s: simon wish // n: nj ollsten // c: catch business
PRE-ORDER QUICK FIX BY CATCH BUSINESS HERE, OFFICIALLY OUT AUG 15th-- just in time for The Next Lit Fest!!!!
s: hi !!
s: sorry i just figured out how to work this
c: no worries! how are u?
c: its cute to see the 2 avis like dancing w each other
s: im at a coffee shop outside in an ally in the center city of philly its so funny
c: haha why in the alley?
s: i kept telling everyone all day that i had a business meeting tn, but then i realized that…ur catch business
s: the outside seating is in an alley ??
c: oh lmao. i just thought u were in the alley. i don't get out much
s: someones parked in the alley playing cardi b out their car
n: omg my roommate is one legged in the room playing violin like a flamingo
c: wow i want to see that
n: he’s walking around now, just practicing
c: typical, lol
c: well thank you both so much for asking me to do this!!
n: thanks so much for doing it!!
c: im excited. i haven't done an interview in so long. i love that its an inter_re_view
n: i have never been the interviewer! ya i thought that was a good way to put it, like i wanna hear ur thoughts abt life rn and also talk abt the work
s: yeah !! i was gonna say, i feel like so much of the book, or so much of the actual spaces IRL in the book, they're so domestic, but also mystic
i feel like reading it made me just yeah, want talk w u about life stuff haha
it reminded me a lot of bjork’s vesper tine album, and what that album makes me think of, but also vulnicura, which is like a breakup album. but so much more, and i think the book occupies something like that for me too, like the poems about longing, love, desire, and difficulty in that, and moving through your life with those feelings, how they’re actually more than that.
c: i would definitely say my writing is metaphysical, because my thinking naturally resides in that realm. the physical is harder for me to navigate maybe, so i do rely on my feelings. and you’re right they are more than that, our feelings create our reality.
s: yes !!
c: so i’ve been recently realizing that maybe the physical isn't actually so hard for me to navigate, but its been my perspective that it has been thats kept it harder for me.
n: i was gonna say! i love the space in this book, like i feel as if the metaphysics are linked to physical distances n events like kinda fleshy landscapes
c: yes the physical distance creates an absence which i then occupy
s: the poem “how to wear a crop top to office depot”
c: lol that title
s: it reminded me of what it feels like, or i imagined all of the times i was in like staples or old navy or something but navigating that kind of space while being in the wreckage of my own emotions. and how moving through spaces, and yeah ! like you said, feelings are our realities. not to say that the poems point towards emotional wreckage, I'm just dramatic abt my own emotions. i think something amazing actually is how the book deals w these spaces and desires with such clarity even, and i think he metaphysical aspects of that and your views and handling of your emotions come through. you treat them like gems i feel, or it reads that way, like emotional experiences are pearls 2 u
c: its been surprising to me to hear some of the feedback on these poems, because it feels like my current emotions are really present in what i wrote two years ago. it makes sense to me now tho, to see that my authentic self was there with me even when i was struggling
n: mmm!! i loved the sense i got of poems being a way to gain energy, but also being a way of transmitting an inner energy out into the text. i loved the ways that language became like a cave to see these little prisms of experience, the language cave which directed the reverberations of experience—i wanted to ask u abt ur theories of language!!! like as a math or as a machine, however ur currently thinking of it
s: yes !! NJ!!!!!
c: oh ya there’s that poem called language is a chance for math to make us more than math lol
n: ya ya!! that one and a few others which have lines abt language were so precious to me. i was looking, while i wrote that, at “i cant tell you anymore: n thinking about “reminding someone” where u write “i understand what it means to
understand/ i’m tired of using language for it”
or abt language being abt energy—that’s a thought i’ve held really dear to me for a long time n i really loved seeing it in print
s: there’s also the one that has the lines that say something like “my language” and “your language”
n: yes yes! or the “traumatic/dramatic” kinda reflection in the beginning, like being mistaken or the optics of a situation being fuzzy—-the language of it changing how its seen or smith like that
c: the line “language doesn't seem necessary / but air touches everything”
n: !! yse!!!
c: the way we are all touched by language, and how it feels different for each of us each time
s: i always think of language as reality, or as a house of reality, but language also is emotion or the expression of emotion
c: but ya i do think energy is the main form of language and our language is shaped by our energy but our energy also informs our language, like the way we are read or heard
n: language is breath is air is grass i feel like, idk. yes yes
c: something i told myself a long time ago is that I'm in constant communication with everything
s: GEMINI !!
n: i was gonna ask!!! ur sign!!!!
c: hahaha yes. the thing about being a gemini is that you’re def in constant communication with your selves. its nice tho when you figure it out you have the best friend in yourself.
s: yeah ! i also always think of gemini’s as the grand communicators
c: we get a rep for being two faced but we really just do a good job at seeing all sides of things
s: THATS WHAT I ALWAYS SAY !!!
c: haha thank you!
s: i always say ppl always get confused about gemini because they think they’re lying about all their views/opinions/whatever because they can hold many, but they just actually do hold that many, and all the facets, i love it
c: ya it can be dizzying for sure : ) but i think us gems like that.
it’s easy to get confused, but once you get to know yourself it’s just fun.
n: thought for a second u meant gems like rocks n was so excited by that
n: it’s true tho n getting to know yourself is fun! i think thats the best part of poems, using language as a mirror for ur experience.
s: i do feel like the book holds the self like a gem, or reaches for that
s: yes!!! nj!
n: but then also how like, temporary and airy that is.
c: i think writing poetry is probably a ritual of the self
s: absolutely! its mystic too
c: and yes, poetry is transitional and so are we
n: 4 sure
s: like alchemy! yes! and initiating the self
n: mm very much like alchemy!! i like that idea v much, its v like, materials based
s: yeah, and transforming it into something else. mercury comes up in old alchemy practices a lot too
c: oh nice full circle
c: gemini is ruled by mercury
n: mm, thinking about alchemy as part of that physical —> metaphysical —> personal too, that poem w glistening tired turning over n over again to meet infinity, followed immediately by memory loss n love…
s: verse, like, poetic verse, the term comes from the over turning of a plow in a field
n: yes! i love that! from old greek methods (?) of reading
c: new life
n: which would turn over on themselves @ the end of a line!!
s: poetry is witchcraft
c: witch craft!
s: catch, do you have a lot of daily routines? or weekly routines?
c: for writing? or witchcraft?
s: no just in life, like are you, a routine oriented person ? is that a weird question ?
c: no, and i would say i’m not routine oriented. i think i do have a routine, because of the need to have a job and sleep and stuff, but in all facets of my life i try to be as open to possibilities as possible so like i try to stay present and do whatever it is that comes to me in that moment
s: is that how you often write too ?
c: ya! i don’t have a writing routine, the closest thing to that i would say is like i usually transcribe and edit when i need to late at night. i write when a poem comes to me. i never really try to evoke them either.
s: yeah! i was gonna ask about that earlier too, if they sort of just come to you
n: i can see that! i think the works to a kind of true to life-ness, like not exaggerated in any way. how poems happen feels central 2 me, n i love that.
s: yeah i think that’s something that i love so much about the book, it has this true to lifeness, or its like, true to life, but also metaphysical, which is a reality, hahaha and true to life, but its amazing to have an “objectivity” include something a lot of people would say isn't “objective” (ie metaphysical and mystical stuff)
c: ya i think the main point here is that a lot of ppl don't take the metaphysical realm seriously, but it’s a real thing which i often associate with the feminine, both of which i often associate with poetry, (vs. fiction, more masculine/physical)
s: yes !!!
c: so for my personal work in all ways i try to bring a balance between both
s: i was gonna say it blows me away how you mediate the two and the presumptions of the metaphysical realm, it’s so relieving i think. it makes me feel so relieved, reading and experiencing the way you do that.
c: wow thank you. it’s all cause of love
s: i would wanna read an essay u write about love
s: but also your tweets do just that, all you tweet about is love
n: i’ve been loving ur tweets abt love n care n community lately
c: im working on a big book of poems about my thoughts on love. thank you : )
s: yes !
n: ya that would be s o g o o d!
c: love is all i think about
n: i can’t wait!!!!!
s: i’m p sure my main purpose in life is love, loving, being a lover, it’s also relieving to be able to see someone also as, into it! but also, or haha, idk what I'm trying to say i lost it. your dedication to love is inspiring ! thats what i was trying to say haha
c: im smiling so big
n: *rose emoji*
c: just blushing
s: i feel like all i have to say now r just compliments 2 u. you said that most of the poems, or all of them you wrote two years ago
c: lol omg, yes all of them
s: is there usually that length of time between writing and compiling books ?
c: i think it depends on the book, but this book i actually forgot i wrote and then found like 6 months ago maybe?
s: omfg amazing
c: haha, i have another book i wrote at this same time and focused on that and just forgot about this one
n: which book was that one?? or is it published?? do you have a stockpile?
c: its called bleach tooth, it hasn’t come out yet
n: that name! teeth! so good!
c: no :/ i actually have no books of my own right now. thank you :)
n: mm—so is it like, bursts of writing? or just a very prolific period?
c: i think I'm just prolific lol
s: you truly are
n: oh i thought u meant u didn’t have any more manuscripts
c: like that book of poems i mentioned was over 100k+
n: that’s sick! i love the long ones
c: i write a lot! I'm actually thinking of breaking it into a series. but we’ll see
n: !!! i’m excited for everything in the future tbr, wanna learn more abt love from catch biz.
c: that’s so encouraging!
s: me too! I'm so excited to all interface in fever
n: yes!! that will be ! so good!
s: and just beyond also
c: I'm so excited i literally was unable to contain myself last night and just started laughing and yelling about it. : )
n: *sapling emoji*
s: yes! the sprout! catch, is there anything u always want ppl to ask you about your work, but never get asked?
c: haha jk sorta
s: truly!! noo tru!
n: it is
s: you're doing work for the people
c: aw ya i just don't want to ask my friends specifically bc i know we are all already supporting each other so much, but i do wish more people in general were into poetry.
n: ya i think that opening things up in the way u r will really help. like i would give a lot of these poems to ppl to teach them abt poems as just reverberations of feeling n reflection
s: yeah i’m always wondering why, its not an art that in general gets interacted with, but it’s prolly bc institutions etc like throughout time. its kept from the ppl
n: ya n i think teaching abt them, like ppl have to say what a poem definitively means, but they are so much more complex bc experience is so complex n dense n ppl move thru it in so many ways
c: yes poetry is a reflection of life
s: i think that feels like something that a lot of writings in the e lit scene have! u know, this reclamation or, trying to rework the disillusionment that poetry is not them (writers poets, )
c: and people need to love life to love poetry, maybe. idk that’s another discussion i could have.
s: i think thats part of it yeah! that’s so much, makes me think of so much and gets my heart wheels turning
c: i agree w you simon, its hard to have confidence as a poet when were constantly being faced with rejection. like not even rejections to our submissions, but rejection of our art as a whole
c: yes i love the way poetry inspires me to live my life!
s: i think thats why its hard for me to connect in the same way with photographers as i do poets, because like i am a photographer, or i do it, but i’m actually a poet and approach all my practice and beliefs of art as a poet hehe, poets are mystics
c: i think that’s what I'm realizing about every aspect of my life, that it’s all poetry and so i actually have like a good grasp on the feel of how i want to live already, and now its just about believing in myself, like being unafraid of just being a poet . i think it’s all about the ways we’ve been conditioned to think, and then feeling our own power to change our ways of thinking into what we actually want. so many people don't get poetry and thats been projected onto me, but as i’ve gained more confidence in who i am i also surrender more and more to the fact that that person loves poetry. and once i can stop fighting it, i believe its just gonna take off
s: and can also create poetry that transcends those projections of poetry! cause you do that !!!!!
c: im seriously so happy to hear that
s: yeah wow I'm so excited to see what you do
c: what we do!
s: yes! i was gonna say wow, blessed 2 be in it. i have to get going but
c: i feel the same way! this was amazing!
s: yes! it was <3
c: thank you both for making me feel so good about writing
n: tysm!! loved hearing from both of u!! so excited for the future of writing :)
s: me too!!! thank you both for all you do and share
n: writing is powerful!! keep going!!